Re: Kenya Defence Forces (KDF)

mogen Fri Sep 14 2012, 16:06

jasiri wrote:@Risasi hio website haifungui the aircraft performance part. I can't comment on the performance without its stats..i will assume it has the same handling problems of the original design(air frame design hasn't changed).
@Mjeshi, i was always a fan of Woo's naval fleet. kwanza the Song class SSK's.
And another attack on a policeman, this time an Administration Policeman allegedly BEHEADED!!! in Kwale County! All indications point to Coast being the hot spot in next years elections. Sad, very very sad.

@Jas

very sad indeed. The full story in here:
http://www.standardmedia.co.ke/?articleID=2000066126&story_title=Armed-youth-behead-AP-officer-

countersniper Fri Sep 14 2012, 16:27

The gok must must and must move considerable resources to combat this menace.
no room for playing safe blah blah blah human rights.
what do you think the family of the beheaded policeman think?
the cops and all police stations must be in permanent red alert mode.

seems to me the average cop does not think tactically..why arrest five men on your own without calling for help and also why did those suspects arrested not have hand cuffs? does it men the cops don't have tools for the trade.

Cycoh 'DUDUS' Fri Sep 14 2012, 16:41

carllmax wrote:well av been a vivid follower of this forum for some time now and i gotta say keep it up guys as i wanna commend all of yah for all your professionalism in all the matters you discuss. hope am welcomed

You are welcome. Ride safe.

Cycoh 'DUDUS' Fri Sep 14 2012, 16:47

jasiri wrote:...... on another note, how did the Danes manage a cost of only $50M for the Knud Rasmusses class? Beats even the chinese bana! ....

Did i miss something? Maybe, something is not adding up bro. Please clarify.

jasiri Fri Sep 14 2012, 17:05

Cycoh 'DUDUS' wrote:
jasiri wrote:...... on another note, how did the Danes manage a cost of only $50M for the Knud Rasmusses class? Beats even the chinese bana! ....
Did i miss something? Maybe, something is not adding up bro. Please clarify.

Te Knud Rasmussen class of OPV's for the Danish Navy were constructed at a cost of about $50M each Knud Rasmussen

In December 2003, the Danish parliament approved 507M Kroner (Cdn $105.8M) for construction of two new Knud Rasmussen class offshore patrol ships for North Atlantic and Arctic waters

Kenya Defence Forces (KDF) - Page 13 KnudRasmussen01_svn

Cycoh 'DUDUS' Fri Sep 14 2012, 17:26

jasiri wrote:...... on another note, how did the Danes manage a cost of only $50M for the Knud Rasmusses class? Beats even the chinese bana! ....

[/quote]Did i miss something? Maybe, something is not adding up bro. Please clarify.[/quote]

[/quote]Te Knud Rasmussen class of OPV's for the Danish Navy were constructed at a cost of about $50M each Knud Rasmussen

In December 2003, the Danish parliament approved 507M Kroner (Cdn $105.8M) for construction of two new Knud Rasmussen class offshore patrol ships for North Atlantic and Arctic waters

[/quote]
The problem resided in the question setting @Jas. Your question was made to imply two outcomes as i had previously quoted above; (a) How did the Danes manage to pay the HEFTY price of $105.8m? (b) The irony portrayed by such a health country in buying OPVs worthy JUST $105.8m silent

Had no doubts with the prices.

chui Fri Sep 14 2012, 17:27

http://www.strategypage.com/qnd/somalia/articles/20120914.aspx

The final assault on Kismayo has been ready to go for weeks. What's holding up the attack are political differences between the various clans in the area of southern Somalia (called Jubaland) occupied by Kenyan troops. Kismayo is the largest city (and port) in the area and a major economic prize to whichever clan controls it. The capture of Ksimayo will complete the creation of Jubaland and the inability of the local clan leaders to agree on who shall control what is delaying the attack to seize the city.

Guest Fri Sep 14 2012, 17:56

hope they get down to the Kismayo attack.they've done well on the open country warfare we need to rate their urban warfare skills but we know they will make us proud

UncleBoni Fri Sep 14 2012, 19:22

Indeed they look mean.
Kenya Defence Forces (KDF) - Page 13 Specop13

Guest Fri Sep 14 2012, 20:46

githinjibn wrote:Indeed they look mean>

Take it easy with the baptism, fellas Most of these chaps are prayerful dads; I'm certain they will take exception to the "B-word". I do. Hehe!

Chaps in that pic are Rangers recon unit. The Deltas are kidogo "casual" in BDU - british influence.

@Spartan - it is too quiet in Kivu and Ituri. Out with it, bro - are all players holding ground or is it the great lull before the storm? Share what you can.

jasiri Fri Sep 14 2012, 21:41

@cycoh Dudus the question was "with such an obviously advanced vessel, ho did the Danes manage to squeeze the cost down to 50M USD?"
@Ole Nkarei, one face in that pic looks exceptionally feminine. Do we have female operators? Exclamation

countersniper Fri Sep 14 2012, 22:36

githinjibn wrote:Indeed they look mean.

there are abut four females in this group. you can see them easily when you play the whole clip.

IT SEEMS there is baptism of fire awaiting in kismayu

http://www.africareview.com/News/Somali+militants+vow+to+defend+strategic+stronghold/-/979180/1507310/-/k5tda2/-/index.html

Guest Sat Sep 15 2012, 08:34

jasiri wrote:@cycoh Dudus the question was "with such an obviously advanced vessel, ho did the Danes manage to squeeze the cost down to 50M USD?"
@Ole Nkarei, one face in that pic looks exceptionally feminine. Do we have female operators?

chui Sat Sep 15 2012, 09:06

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10000872396390443779404577643514166217828.html

Ugandan military officials complain that Kenya has used the influence of its diplomats in the AU to take over key commanding positions in Somalia.

Kenya's defense spokesman denied any rifts with its East African neighbor: "If there are any issues, that's under the docket" of the African Union, he said.

Still, some Ugandan brass feel sidelined.

"We shall not help Kenyans in Kismayo because they did not help us in Mogadishu," said a recently ousted Ugandan commander, referring to Kenya's influence over the AU's Somalia headquarters in Mogadishu.

jasiri Sat Sep 15 2012, 09:17

chui wrote:http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10000872396390443779404577643514166217828.html

Ugandan military officials complain that Kenya has used the influence of its diplomats in the AU to take over key commanding positions in Somalia.

Kenya's defense spokesman denied any rifts with its East African neighbor: "If there are any issues, that's under the docket" of the African Union, he said.

Still, some Ugandan brass feel sidelined.

"We shall not help Kenyans in Kismayo because they did not help us in Mogadishu," said a recently ousted Ugandan commander, referring to Kenya's influence over the AU's Somalia headquarters in Mogadishu.

Hehehe u beat me to it, chui. Im not sure however someone from unified command can issue such reckless statements. If true, then that means that there's a much serious problem sub-surface than we r seeing. However i think these journalist overplayed the significance of the disagreements. Without emotions (Spartan, Countersniper) should Uganda/Burundi fail to provide necessary ground support, what impact will this have on the overall push for Chismayo?

Guest Sat Sep 15 2012, 09:25

[quote"jasiri">@Ole Nkarei, one face in that pic looks exceptionally feminine. Do we have female operators?[/quote]
There are women in both 30th and 40th of SOCOM doing all manner of jobs, as there are in as SF formation in Britain and America. Our two SF components mirror the ethos of their "Parent" Formation despite cross trying, equipment and tactics being closely similar. The fighting unit of the 30th comprises of a five-man stick and four of the sticks in one Troop. Four of these Troops on full standby, one in reserve and one small HQ - that IS the "Company" though not YET typically at " normal" Company strength. The 30th has four such "Companies. As you can see, it is not your typical military Formation and is tightly compartmentalized in each level. . The 40th is a meatier version of your normal orthodox Battalion, a light Cavalry Formation with an integrated Recon Company that mirrors the American Marine Recon in size and equipment and tasking. Under this circumstance it is possible to integrate women in fields ops with the 40th. The 30th fashion each Stick as a highly compartmentalized and fully independent fighting unit - the chemical balance in the stick very brittle and absolutely vital. A woman in this Stick would upset this unimaginably in ways only a soldier that has been on an extended covert deployment in a hostile hot theatre would understand.

Not even the American SEALS and DELTA have women in their fighting Units. In the SAS and SBS - next century maybe. The Brits has women in their SRR but that is as far as she goes.

Nothing inferior in women to explain this. But evolution has not created warriors in women, folks. War us not your noisy parliament which conducts like a livestock market sometimes. This one-third affirmative action has limitations. And this is one of them. Would I dispatch a Troop into Jubba with a women compliment? Not with the 30th. Not even on a close protection drill.

Situation Awareness, instinctive and correct reactions, Spacial Seoaration, skeletal amd muscle rigidity, emotional balance etc is unequal in women and men soldiers in combat. And many other distinctions. The greater one is endowed with these, and a healthy amount of luck, will bring a man home alive from combat.

Hiyo tuu.

countersniper Sat Sep 15 2012, 09:28

who ever wrote hat article is stupid
simple fact checking would have shown him that Kenyans entry into the war has enabled faster defeat of alshabab by stretching them thin and killing hundredS of alshabab in the south.
Ugandans were stuck in Mogadishu for two to three years ..and made headway in the last half year by taking afgoye and other suburbs outside Mogadishu 30 kilometer radius. in contrast kdf has now taken an area almost 150 thousand square kilometers ,including every major town center southwards except kismayu
so the question of Kenya needing to help them Ugandans taking mogadishu does not therefore arise.

and if Ugandans and Burundians don't want to help pushing into kismayu...then so be it...Kenyans can and should have taken kismayu on their own ..IN FACT IT WAS A MISTAKE TO WAIT THIS LONG HOPING TO BE HELPED BY THESE OTHER FORCES.
kdf should have done the necessary and taken kismayu last year..and then by now be pacifying it .

jasiri Sat Sep 15 2012, 10:29

The fighting unit of the 30th comprises of a five-man stick and four of the sticks in one Troop. Four of these Troops on full standby, one in reserve and one small HQ - that IS the "Company" though not YET typically at " normal" Company strength. The 30th has four such "Companies. As you can see, it is not your typical military Formation and is tightly compartmentalized in each level.

Reminds me of a T.V Series that used to air called The Unit. 5 man team, one back at ops HQ n other four at the field. I don't clearly rem their placements but one for sure had sniper over-watch (as necessary) n the others were the spear tip.
@C.Sniper, i too don't believe it's mere coincidence that UGABAG broke out of Mugadishu when we started rolling into the south. Fact, the 'Tactical withdrawal' Al-Kebab did was to stymie the eforts of KDF back in the south...they failed. Chismayo had more value to Shabab than Muqdisho and so the need to re-deploy their fighters to buffer its defences. This is what enabled UGABAG to break out of Mugadishu. For Wamala to disregard this, it may imply that either the author fabricated this story or the Gen. is a bitter man (which i highly doubt in a professional soldier). In any case, the KDF-Naval and Air support is not part of AMISOM what then stops us from bringing in a few more KDF infantry if tully our numbers are that lacking? If this article has any truths in it, we have a long way to go before we become allies in the true sense of the word.

countersniper Sat Sep 15 2012, 11:02

taken from wall steet journal

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10000872396390443779404577643514166217828.html
Last month, 600 Ugandan troops were ordered to leave Mogadishu to
pave way for Kenyans, after the Ugandans exceeded an AU troop-strength
quota, said Gen. Katumba Wamala, Uganda's commander of land forces in
Somalia.Ugandan military officials complain that Kenya has used the influence
of its diplomats in the AU to take over key commanding positions in
Somalia.Kenya's defense spokesman denied any rifts with its East African
neighbor: "If there are any issues, that's under the docket" of the
African Union, he said.Still, some Ugandan brass feel sidelined.We shall not help Kenyans in Kismayo because they did not help us in
Mogadishu," said a recently ousted Ugandan commander, referring to
Kenya's influence over the AU's Somalia headquarters in Mogadishu. Under
the A.U. plan, Kenya leads the land and naval assault on Kismayo while
Uganda is assigned to reinforce the offensive with its air force.
That air support has hit a complication. On Aug. 12, three Ugandan
combat helicopters crashed into the mountains of Kenya, deepening
strains between the two countries.Kenyan aviation officials say the pilots of Uganda's ill-fated
helicopters were communicating in their local languages, making it
difficult for Kenyans to assist them when they hit turbulence.Uganda's President Yoweri Museveni says the helicopters fell victim
to sabotage, not rough weather. The Ugandan president hasn't said who he
suspects of the sabotage, or what the motive would have been, but has
appointed his brother, Gen. Salim Saleh, to probe the crash."I cannot listen to stories of bad weather of the Kenya mountains,"
President Museveni said. "Mountains are clearly shown on maps. If the
weather is bad, you do not fly."Mr. Ongeri, the Kenyan defense spokesman, said that the flight routes
for the helicopters were agreed upon between Uganda and Kenya. He also
denied any suggestions of possible sabotage. "From our part, we did our
best and even the Ugandan military can attest to that," Mr. Ongeri said.

Guest Sat Sep 15 2012, 11:11

jasiri wrote: Reminds me of a T.V Series that used to air called The Unit. 5 man team, one back at ops HQ n other four at the field....

Well movie scripts generally must contain factual story lines. For those about secretive "spearheads" military Units whose success lies to a degree in their ubiquitous identity, the factual component diametrically lessens. Now, throw that Sammy uses Hollywood to intimidate the rest of us with grotesque exaggerations of his pecker! And that American movie do have a domestic consumer market that require the scripts to be "relevant to contemporaneous social imperatives of ordinary families.

As concerns the manenos between UPDF and KDF - tis a poor secret that some tensions have arisen. Nothing abnormal about that. Two competitive and motivated Armed groups in one room. No matter anyway - the political imperative will drive both Militaries. We need to be wary of these deliberate and very transparent schemes to create mountains of what is merely professional rivalries between UPDF and KDF, brothers..

I said that co-opting the Amisom and ENDF in Kismaayu was not a Military necessity but a Political Imperative infformed by a need to close alshabaab through a political statement. Remember that only a Brigade of KDF is Amisom while the AirCav Airforce Navy and the many other specialised KDF elements involved in OLN are not. Also Marka s is the nearest point to Kismaayu that the UPDF is - four hundred kilometers of AS infested territory. UGABAG needs Helios to make that jump to Kismaayu .ENDF is presently in hibernation mode.

countersniper Sat Sep 15 2012, 11:57

experienced ex Kenya air force pilot and now commandant of Kenya defense college at karen has been asked to join the inquiry being led by musevenis brother who has set up base in a hotel in Nairobi

http://www.monitor.co.ug/News/National/Kenya+officers+join+Uganda+chopper+crash+investigation/-/688334/1506640/-/lr5gwdz/-/index.html

Nesta Sat Sep 15 2012, 11:59

The guy who wrote that article has his own agenda.

UncleBoni Sat Sep 15 2012, 13:10

githinjibn wrote:Indeed they look mean.

Seeking pardon from @ON and other forumners.

mogen Sat Sep 15 2012, 14:13

Marching at the slower pace of the C-in-C can be tricky business as the GSU Commandant must have felt.

https://youtu.be/RHQCuhegMtk

Guest Sat Sep 15 2012, 14:28

[quote="githinjibn"]

githinjibn wrote:>Seeking pardon from @ON and other forumners.

Take it easy, bro. Ain't nothing to it - figure of speech is all. You should listen to them after extraction and debriefing - space language is all it can be what they use, man!

Btw this Amisom thing is so delicately held together and so utterly vital for the health of this EAC-expanded. We should all water it, taking care not to exaggerate its teething problems. They will be many tests in the future.

countersniper Sat Sep 15 2012, 14:45

mogen wrote:
Marching at the slower pace of the C-in-C can be tricky business as the GSU Commandant must have felt.

https://youtu.be/RHQCuhegMtk

very nice...classic Very Happy

humor...

Cycoh 'DUDUS' Sat Sep 15 2012, 14:48

@Jasiri. The Knud Rusmussen class OPVs were constructed at different facilities, in different countries, which could have triggered such a well watered bargaining chip.

[/quote] ...hulls are build as far away as Ukraine or Romania and towed as far as northern Norway. Propulsion gear is fitted in Poland before hulls are towed to Denmark for complete outfitting. [/qoute]
More infi here; [url=Knud class.]http://www.ca/id-danish-naval-projects-rasmussen.htm[/url]

@O.N. Who the heck with empty quotes? I reckon you though. Just some "nitty gritty responsibility" fixations. Worry not, still coming to birth, hehe.. For the moment, patience can sort any godamn 'chameleon-paced' ideolism.

aggressor one Sat Sep 15 2012, 15:59

jasiri wrote:
chui wrote:http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10000872396390443779404577643514166217828.html

Ugandan military officials complain that Kenya has used the influence of its diplomats in the AU to take over key commanding positions in Somalia.

Kenya's defense spokesman denied any rifts with its East African neighbor: "If there are any issues, that's under the docket" of the African Union, he said.

Still, some Ugandan brass feel sidelined.

"We shall not help Kenyans in Kismayo because they did not help us in Mogadishu," said a recently ousted Ugandan commander, referring to Kenya's influence over the AU's Somalia headquarters in Mogadishu.
Hehehe u beat me to it, chui. Im not sure however someone from unified command can issue such reckless statements. If true, then that means that there's a much serious problem sub-surface than we r seeing. However i think these journalist overplayed the significance of the disagreements. Without emotions (Spartan, Countersniper) should Uganda/Burundi fail to provide necessary ground support, what impact will this have on the overall push for Chismayo?

The writer simply created that quote which is why he is quoting an ousted officer. The General Wamala that i know very well cannot make such reckless statements.

cylon Sat Sep 15 2012, 20:12

mogen wrote:
Marching at the slower pace of the C-in-C can be tricky business as the GSU Commandant must have felt.

https://youtu.be/RHQCuhegMtk

What happened to the days when we had "FIT" commanders??? That GSU commandant should have been retired and replaced, It does not paint a good picture at the command of such a professional unit as the GSU

Uzi Sun Sep 16 2012, 08:03

In light of the recent capture of weapons in Nairobi i suggest that all uniforms either KPS or KDF volunteer in securing their places of worship. U guys will agree with me most our churches are "naked". Instead of attending as a worshipper lets work with the ushers in securing our people.

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