Re: Kenya Defence Forces (KDF)

Guest Tue Jul 17 2012, 10:10

That may very well be. But then there is Occam's razor.
Why not simply come clean? Why devise an intricate and convoluted plan (and in the process raise a tsunami of suspicion) to send a respected (albeit egotistic?) journalist on a wild goose chase when it would be the simplest thing in the world to say "Look, this is when Kabuga was here, for this long, this is what he did, this is when he left, this is where he went and here are the documents to prove it, so, Kigali, shove it?" The answer, I guess, is in the multi-tasking and my need to know. But what "National Interests", prithee, would justify spending my taxes in such a manner?
Speaking of which, the problem is that Wanjiku remains to be convinced that it is her (national) interests that are being protected and not those of a select few. Who determines what those national interests are? The Spymaster who is generally viewed as having politicised that first-class outfit created by the famed Wilson Boinett? The Taskmasters that find it opportune to keep him around though his feet are generally regarded as being too small for Boinett's boots?
The NSIS is awesome. For such a professional and devastatingly effective machine, sanctity and neutrality are paramount. The moment it is perceived as having lost its virginity, it risks being viewed as the Establishment's political police. Which would be grossly unfair to those patriotic Kenyans risking their lives every day (and likely working for a pittance) to keep us safe.
We've been there before.

ole Nkarei wrote:Aiseei, give us some credit, joo!! And let debate move on away from Kabuga!! Intel Agencies are not single-faceted in their tasking - we face multiple threats on several fronts, each as legitimate as the other, bana!!

By the time the Spooks are let loose, it is too damn late for niceties, politeness, foreplay, pussy-footing, moralizing, democracy, public needs-to-know, and all those other proper-sounding idealism and indignation peeping out of some posts here. The sole consideration is the ‘’National Interests’’ , by whatever means and manner – some only ‘’legal’’ because they are never revealed outside the Spook-House. It is why the Spooks get called in. It is why the Spooks stay in the shadows, never visible, and exactly how/ why Civilian Oversight actually crafted it so. Everything is fair play and all obstacles are legitimate targets when the Spooks start running. The End justifies the means and cost. There is need to make clear distinctions in the Peoples’ Interface (need-to-know) between the Policing Authority and the Military & Civilian Spooks

So, the Tall Thin Man and his greedy Foreign legion in the Arusha Tribunal start yapping about Kabuga just as their Arusha Mandate draws to a close. Allan Namu is easily roped in due to his excessive ego. Was it expected that we all lay back and get shafted by these selfish fellas in Arusha? Ati a guy worth 400Millions Shillings DEAD OR ALIVE is ‘’protectable’’ in Kenya? In Kenya?? Wearing the same face, same associates, tightly linked to his old family, running legitimate businesses without aliases nor even using fronts? Ati because he has connections in High places in Kenya? And money to buy an incongruous living in Kenya – with a 400Million bounty on his head?? That has got to be the most seriously twisted logic ever possible!! Even if there was some National justification for hiding this bastard in kenya, is it to be accepted that we are utterly incapable of generating for Kabuga and iron-clad new legend, new face, new Identity, new history, new family, new wife, new prostitute, new life, new everything? What the hell do some people take us to be, for crying out loud?

1998, we hunted down and wiped out two teams of 38 assassins within Nairobi and the environs, with an open hunting license to track down and kill Political, Civil Servant and Military officials of the previous government hiding in Kenya. And that was the last Units ever sent to Kenya, though these killers have roamed the entire globe periodically assassinating any real and perceived revisionist / reactionary Rwandaise in the diaspora.

Guest Tue Jul 17 2012, 10:19

mogen wrote:What I disagree with is distractions such as participating in the scripting Kabuga circus stories while there are many more important and urgent matters of state security for them to deal with.
't b
In 1995-96 I worked with a highly qualified Rwandese professional in Nairobi who told me about the hunting gangs from their country who were dispatched to roam abroad and ...

I agree with you two. We should move on from this Kabuga debate and this is my last post about it. [/justify]

National Intelligence is holistic, extensive in scope and undertaking, and very complex. Each facet of it as important as the next - no matter that those outside the ''loop'' understand and or approve it or not! Nothing that Military and Civilian Intel Agencies get engaged in is even remotely akin to distractions, nor senseless, unjustified in terms of National Objectives (the method may be questionable), without purpose, ill-thought, ill-considered, and any of the other superlatives generally indicating of a lacking directional purpose.

We might no all accept there may be National justifications for Kabuga-in-Kenya (nor even that he might be in Kenya, to start with) but if he was, it would not be because of some knee-jerk reactionary efforts to transient personal politico-economic considerations of some ruling class/elite. Wouldn't be markedly easier, less messier, more convenient and financially more rewarding (400Million DEAD or ALIVE Bounty!!) to just kill be bugger, take his prints (or cut his hands off), photograph his dead arse, and hand these over to the Americans?

Those Extermination Teams we exterminated in 1998 were the last such Tutsi/RPF units sent into Kenya. They have mapped the location, lifestyles and activities of their detractors of the former government, but they cannot dare bring their nonsensical fracticidal diagreements into Kenya. Period!!

Guest Tue Jul 17 2012, 10:52

Vitruvian wrote:That may very well be. But then there is Occam's razor.
Why not simply come clean? Why devise an intricate and convoluted plan (and in the process raise a tsunami of suspicion) to send a respected (albeit egotistic?) journalist on a wild goose chase when it would be the simplest thing in the world to say "Look, this is when Kabuga was here, for this long, this is what he did, this is when he left, this is where he went and here are the documents to prove it, so, Kigali, shove it?" The answer, I guess, is in the multi-tasking and my need to know. But what "National Interests", prithee, would justify spending my taxes in such a manner?
Speaking of which, the problem is that Wanjiku remains to be convinced that it is her (national) interests that are being protected and not those of a select few. Who determines what those national interests are? The Spymaster who is generally viewed as having politicised that first-class outfit created by the famed Wilson Boinett? The Taskmasters that find it opportune to keep him around though his feet are generally regarded as being too small for Boinett's boots?
The NSIS is awesome. For such a professional and devastatingly effective maachine, sanctity and neutrality are paramount. The moment it is perceived as having lost its virginity, it risks being viewed as the Establishment's political police. Which would be grossly unfair to those patriotic Kenyans risking their lives every day (and likely working for a pittance) to keep us safe.
We've been there before.

First of all, our individual skepticisms and convinctions are not a aggregation of ALL Kenyans'.

Beyond assuaging the sensibilities of a indignant Wanjiku, what benefit would ''coming clean'' realistically serve this great Nation? Fact is that what is put out into the public of Intelligence Activities is usually never simplistic, frequently fuzzy, often intended to make murkier the understanding of it. Such as this Namu thing. It is all justified and appropriate. Different from that, keep the Intel Agencies off the ball and keep the Police Agencies engaged on this ball.

I would be a bit presumptuous to declare Maj.Gen Gichangi's competence or lack of it here. Nothing in the Public Dormain gives anyone the basis to make such a determination, methinks. Only enough to make individual perceptions of it. The NSIS has undergone a quantum-type leap in every aspect of it, entirely unrecognized (structure, definition, activity, ability, network, competence, etc) from the Outfit Brig.Boinett founded. Beyond the Policy and Oversight facets, I hazard to point out that political aggravation on the Agency is markedly minimal in comparison. That there has been ''lapses'' is really not from imcompetence but from the exponential growth in sophistication and nature of the Threats we face presently.

Moreover, any casual comparisons between Commanding Officers of as complex and specialized Agencies is kidogo inappropriate.

The asumption that Wanjiku has an absolute right to know, is the last word in the determination of her National Interests, that ALL the forty Million Wanjiku must absolutely be unanimously convinced of every governance programme is, sorry, fallacious and mere idealism at best.

Wanjiku never knew of our bloody rampages (in her name) in South Sudan, the Great Lakes, Somalia, South Ethiopia and most certainly would not have approved anyway.

Lets move away from this Kabuga maneno, I beg OO!!

Guest Tue Jul 17 2012, 12:05

Whereas you are quite correct on this, the buzz and hype across the land would suggest that it is the aggregation of MOST Kenyans.

ole Nkarei wrote:
First of all, our individual skepticisms and convinctions are not a aggregation of ALL Kenyans'.

As for the rest, I'm quite glad to hear it. Except for

ole Nkarei wrote:The asumption that Wanjiku has an absolute right to know, is the last word in the determination of her National Interests, that ALL the forty Million Wanjiku must absolutely be unanimously convinced of every governance programme is, sorry, fallacious and mere idealism at best.

because, frankly, I'm looking for the absolutes in my post but I can't find them.
Wanjiku is, however, entitled to know of matters that may affect her adversely. Such as, say, sanctions (consequences, if you prefer) for reasons she has no control over, is quite oblivious to and that may not be in her best interests. The "relax, we know what's best for you" angle hasn't been selling for a while, mainly because some people have the bad habit of taking a shit with the fan on. There isn't a Wanjiku in the world that would give unfettered and unconditional rein to an institution so powerful without a mechanism for feedback, accountability and control. Well, not willingly. That would be foolish. I have witnessed first-hand what happens when they go rogue.
Luckily for us, such supervision has been entrusted to a benign and well-intentioned executive and a virtuous and noble parliament. Ergo, we have nothing to worry about.
Not a mention of the "K" word. Very Happy

Moving on.

ole Nkarei wrote:Beyond assuaging the sensibilities of a indignant Wanjiku, what benefit would ''coming clean'' realistically serve this great Nation? Fact is that what is put out into the public of Intelligence Activities is usually never simplistic, frequently fuzzy, often intended to make murkier the understanding of it. Such as this Namu thing. It is all justified and appropriate. Different from that, keep the Intel Agencies off the ball and keep the Police Agencies engaged on this ball.

I would be a bit presumptuous to declare Maj.Gen Gichangi's competence or lack of it here. Nothing in the Public Dormain gives anyone the basis to make such a determination, methinks. Only enough to make individual perceptions of it. The NSIS has undergone a quantum-type leap in every aspect of it, entirely unrecognized (structure, definition, activity, ability, network, competence, etc) from the Outfit Brig.Boinett founded. Beyond the Policy and Oversight facets, I hazard to point out that political aggravation on the Agency is markedly minimal in comparison. That there has been ''lapses'' is really not from imcompetence but from the exponential growth in sophistication and nature of the Threats we face presently.

Moreover, any casual comparisons between Commanding Officers of as complex and specialized Agencies is kidogo inappropriate.

The asumption that Wanjiku has an absolute right to know, is the last word in the determination of her National Interests, that ALL the forty Million Wanjiku must absolutely be unanimously convinced of every governance programme is, sorry, fallacious and mere idealism at best.

Wanjiku never knew of our bloody rampages (in her name) in South Sudan, the Great Lakes, Somalia, South Ethiopia and most certainly would not have approved anyway.

Lets move away from this Kabuga maneno, I beg OO!!

Guest Tue Jul 17 2012, 16:40

These two articles ably summarize the political dilemma / dangers we face in Kismayu, which is too close to Lamu / Isiolo for comfort. These squabbling demographics are mirrored in our NFD and their fortunes interlinked. Because the very survival of our Nation depends on the promises of Vision 2030 as regards Northern Kenya - spreading the National goodness into these forgotten regions in the North, one could simply summarize OLN entire Strategy as rotating around a peaceful, vibrant, Lamu-facing Kismayu post-AS.

It is easy to steam-roll into Kismayu and empty it of the remnants of the AS still holding out there - their back is broken now, their Command has all but conceded the War. But see the monstrous dragon incubating, nested by the AS!

http://somaliareport.com/index.php/post/3517/Mini-States_in_Conflict_for_Southern_Somalia

http://somaliareport.com/index.php/subcategory/90//Ministates////14

Guest Tue Jul 17 2012, 16:47

Rais Kikwete sending a Company-size JWTZ Contingent into Syria - Peacekeeping on UN Mandate!!

Eiish!!

And while we are here, JWTZ is going shopping too, a whooping jump to Ksh.58 Billion this year 2012 on Defense - of which nearly half on ''Developmental Activities'' which is an euphemism to Hardware procurement. Interesting times in Kenyana, no doubt!!

Batian Tue Jul 17 2012, 19:38

JWTZ are to be deployed to Syria, now that means complex time
ahead in coming up in the quest for adopting an appropriate form of government
though. Job well done. More concern will arise from the Azhania project and the
Ahlus Sunna wal Jamaah demands factoring in. More vigilance is required however in mogadishu

Guest Tue Jul 17 2012, 23:56

Nothing surprising at all. It is wondrous the Western Civilian Populations are only getting ''aware'' of this now!!

Somalia's president has shielded a top pirate leader from arrest by issuing him a diplomatic passport, according to a United Nations investigation which criticizes the "climate of impunity" enjoyed by pirate kingpins in Somalia and abroad.

The U.N. Monitoring Group on Somalia said in a report to the Security Council, that senior pirate leaders were benefitting from high level protection from Somali authorities and were not being sufficiently targeted for arrest or sanction by international authorities.

The Group said it had obtained evidence a diplomatic passport had been provided "with the authorization of Somali President Sheikh Sharif Sheikh Ahmed" to pirate leader Mohamed Abdi Hassan "Afweyne", who presented it to authorities in Malaysia on a trip there in April.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/07/17/us-somalia-un-piracy-idUSBRE86G0ZN20120717

cylon Wed Jul 18 2012, 01:21

ole Nkarei wrote:Rais Kikwete sending a Company-size JWTZ Contingent into Syria - Peacekeeping on UN Mandate!!

Eiish!!

And while we are here, JWTZ is going shopping too, a whooping jump to Ksh.58 Billion this year 2012 on Defense - of which nearly half on ''Developmental Activities'' which is an euphemism to Hardware procurement. Interesting times in Kenyana, no doubt!!

Will this mean Tz will be able to purchase the flankers??? If they do we will be surrounded by russian jets Wink

mogen Wed Jul 18 2012, 03:13

KDF Jets soften Jungal Village for Allied advance on Bardere

I hear Bardere will fall shortly.

http://somaliareport.com/index.php/post/3525/KDF_Airstrike_Hits_Jungal_Village

And I also hear that a Senior Al Shabaab commander has surrendered to the Allied forces in Jubba Hoose (Lower Jubba) not sure whether it is Mahamed Mahamuud Sayid Carab or who.

And Al Shabab defectors describe hunger and isolation with Somali terrorist group
http://hiiraan.com/news4/2012/July/24942/al_shabab_defectors_describe_hunger_and_isolation_with_somali_terrorist_group.aspx

Spartan Wed Jul 18 2012, 08:36

cylon wrote:
ole Nkarei wrote:Rais Kikwete sending a Company-size JWTZ Contingent into Syria - Peacekeeping on UN Mandate!!

Eiish!!

And while we are here, JWTZ is going shopping too, a whooping jump to Ksh.58 Billion this year 2012 on Defense - of which nearly half on ''Developmental Activities'' which is an euphemism to Hardware procurement. Interesting times in Kenyana, no doubt!!

Will this mean Tz will be able to purchase the flankers??? If they do we will be surrounded by russian jets

So?

Guest Wed Jul 18 2012, 09:48

Spartan wrote:
cylon wrote:
ole Nkarei wrote:Rais Kikwete sending a Company-size JWTZ Contingent into Syria - Peacekeeping on UN Mandate!!

Eiish!!

And while we are here, JWTZ is going shopping too, a whooping jump to Ksh.58 Billion this year 2012 on Defense - of which nearly half on ''Developmental Activities'' which is an euphemism to Hardware procurement. Interesting times in Kenyana, no doubt!!

Will this mean Tz will be able to purchase the flankers??? If they do we will be surrounded by russian jets

So?

Hehehe! Take is easy, @Spartan. Just an observation by the young un'. To generate discussion. Very Happy

Guest Wed Jul 18 2012, 09:48

Spartan wrote:
cylon wrote:
ole Nkarei wrote:Rais Kikwete sending a Company-size JWTZ Contingent into Syria - Peacekeeping on UN Mandate!!

Eiish!!

And while we are here, JWTZ is going shopping too, a whooping jump to Ksh.58 Billion this year 2012 on Defense - of which nearly half on ''Developmental Activities'' which is an euphemism to Hardware procurement. Interesting times in Kenyana, no doubt!!

Will this mean Tz will be able to purchase the flankers??? If they do we will be surrounded by russian jets

So?

Sibling rivalry, Spartan.

one man army Wed Jul 18 2012, 11:15

HI GUYS,GLAD TO BE BACK,
FIRST THINGS FIRST,THANKS FOR KEEPING THE BLOG ALIVE
NOW WHATS YOUR TAKE ON THE OPERATION LN AND THE CHIEF OF DEFENSE FORCES (K.D.F) IMPLYING THAT KISMAYU WILL BE TAKEN BY AUGUST?AUGUST IS HERE YET NO ACTION!

kimiti Wed Jul 18 2012, 12:02

Hello guys
Can anyone of you noble people especially the enlisted ones help me. Am looking for information on the contribution of the East African soldiers in the seconrd world war. Their contribution seems to have been suppressed by history and any information is scanty.

again, any news from the Kismayo theater. All is quiet on the eastern front.

cylon Wed Jul 18 2012, 14:27

Spartan wrote:
cylon wrote:
ole Nkarei wrote:Rais Kikwete sending a Company-size JWTZ Contingent into Syria - Peacekeeping on UN Mandate!!

Eiish!!

And while we are here, JWTZ is going shopping too, a whooping jump to Ksh.58 Billion this year 2012 on Defense - of which nearly half on ''Developmental Activities'' which is an euphemism to Hardware procurement. Interesting times in Kenyana, no doubt!!

Will this mean Tz will be able to purchase the flankers??? If they do we will be surrounded by russian jets

So?

Just trying to start a conversation, because i have a feeling we might also go Russian......(regional coaxing)

Looks like Meles might be on his death bed in Brussels.. Will his death embolden the Alshabab to retake Ethiopian held areas and more as they would spread propaganda that ALLAH killed meles for there cause etc etc... you're take guys

Spartan Wed Jul 18 2012, 15:22

cylon wrote:Just trying to start a conversation, because i have a feeling we might also go Russian......(regional coaxing)

Looks like Meles might be on his death bed in Brussels.. Will his death embolden the Alshabab to retake Ethiopian held areas and more as they would spread propaganda that ALLAH killed meles for there cause etc etc... you're take guys

You had left it hanging, and my feeling was that it was nothing new. The whole region has always bought Russian while KDF faithfully stuck with the West. East Africa has better negotiating power if it has uniform technologies, much like what happened with the Railway deal. Of course in matters military we are some way off. But I am sure our sons will laugh at the sibling rivalry we have right now a few decades to come.

Guest Wed Jul 18 2012, 15:57

Spartan wrote:East Africa has better negotiating power if it has uniform technologies, much like what happened with the Railway deal.

You're right, Spartan. You guys had better start buying American jets, heh heh!

cylon Wed Jul 18 2012, 16:03

Spartan wrote:
cylon wrote:Just trying to start a conversation, because i have a feeling we might also go Russian......(regional coaxing)

Looks like Meles might be on his death bed in Brussels.. Will his death embolden the Alshabab to retake Ethiopian held areas and more as they would spread propaganda that ALLAH killed meles for there cause etc etc... you're take guys

You had left it hanging, and my feeling was that it was nothing new. The whole region has always bought Russian while KDF faithfully stuck with the West. East Africa has better negotiating power if it has uniform technologies, much like what happened with the Railway deal. Of course in matters military we are some way off. But I am sure our sons will laugh at the sibling rivalry we have right now a few decades to come.

I agree that the KDF's perception is slowly changing East with our procurements of high-tech russian gunships and Chinese helicopters i could say more is to come, And with Uniformed technologies( in the airforce branch) we would be able to train pilots, teach technicians etc.. or even one day build a jet fighter our kids will fly...

Spartan Wed Jul 18 2012, 17:21

Vitruvian wrote:
Spartan wrote:East Africa has better negotiating power if it has uniform technologies, much like what happened with the Railway deal.

You're right, Spartan. You guys had better start buying American jets, heh heh!

Very funny, there. More so considering that the West still thinks we should only be flying trainers. I usually prefer to get stuff without having to go on bended knee, even when I am going to pay for it.

And this jet can hold its own against most American jets. So thanks but no thanks.

Olekoima Wed Jul 18 2012, 18:24

kimiti wrote:Hello guys
Can anyone of you noble people especially the enlisted ones help me. Am looking for information on the contribution of the East African soldiers in the seconrd world war. Their contribution seems to have been suppressed by history and any information is scanty.

again, any news from the Kismayo theater. All is quiet on the eastern front.

Quiet? Not really. Here is something for you:-

http://allafrica.com/stories/201207180246.html

Olekoima Thu Jul 19 2012, 07:26

ole Nkarei wrote:Rais Kikwete sending a Company-size JWTZ Contingent into Syria - Peacekeeping on UN Mandate!!

Eiish!!

And while we are here, JWTZ is going shopping too, a whooping jump to Ksh.58 Billion this year 2012 on Defense - of which nearly half on ''Developmental Activities'' which is an euphemism to Hardware procurement. Interesting times in Kenyana, no doubt!!

This was in the offing. I remember posting something to that effect on the Tanzanian page a while ago. TZ wouldn't just sit and watch her sibblings racing each other on arms. She was bound to act too.

http://www.ippmedia.com/frontend/index.php?l=36263

Guest Thu Jul 19 2012, 07:42

The South Africans are kicking up celebratory, typically South-Africa-arrogant, noises. The Ole Man won half of his battle, the Kenyan Mwencha elected deputy by near-unanimity. What were the departure points Kenyan-South African?

Some might not know that apart from geo-politico-economic competition Kenya-South Africa, and the naked corruption employed by the South African in their bid (buying off the AU subscription Debts of several poor counties, and dangling preferential bi-lateral deals to others, etc), Kenya's primary objection to South African bid was their government's very tacit involvement in the Weapons Trade (hiring or selling) into Somalia by several South African Firms in contravention of a hazy UNSC Resolution to cut off Arms supply to Somalia and its belligerents. Doggonit, we got men in that Theatre, under clear threat from South African Supplied Weapons!! It is not simply because this is an isolated sanction-breech - hell, South Africa has an documented insidious history of Arms-Trade and Weapons-Training through several South African Government-supported Mercenary Outfits into every flash-point in Africa and to all sides of any conflict. For instance, SADF is deployed into Burundi for a Decade as a Stabilization Force in a conflict in which several South African Private firms have supplied Arms and Mercenaries to both belligerents!! South African private quasi-military organisations have at various times raped the Comoros, Madagasca, DRC, Angola, Equatorial Guinea, Cape Verde, Congo Brazzaville,The Sudan in several states, Ethiopia, Djibouti, Somalia, Liberia/Sierra Leone / Senegal. It wouldn't surprise if Boko Haram and the Malian Insurgency are fueled by South African-supplied Weapons and Weapons Training neither!!

Or that the MRC is tapping into the very large South African Floating Armouries in the Indian Ocean International waters!!

Now they have the AU Chair. On a Morality Platform to boot!! Eiishh!!

countersniper Thu Jul 19 2012, 12:27

ole Nkarei wrote:The South Africans are kicking up celebratory, typically South-Africa-arrogant, noises. The Ole Man won half of his battle, the Kenyan Mwencha elected deputy by near-unanimity. What were the departure points Kenyan-South African?

Some might not know that apart from geo-politico-economic competition Kenya-South Africa, and the naked corruption employed by the South African in their bid (buying off the AU subscription Debts of several poor counties, and dangling preferential bi-lateral deals to others, etc), Kenya's primary objection to South African bid was their government's very tacit involvement in the Weapons Trade (hiring or selling) into Somalia by several South African Firms in contravention of a hazy UNSC Resolution to cut off Arms supply to Somalia and its belligerents. Doggonit, we got men in that Theatre, under clear threat from South African Supplied Weapons!! It is not simply because this is an isolated sanction-breech - hell, South Africa has an documented insidious history of Arms-Trade and Weapons-Training through several South African Government-supported Mercenary Outfits into every flash-point in Africa and to all sides of any conflict. For instance, SADF is deployed into Burundi for a Decade as a Stabilization Force in a conflict in which several South African Private firms have supplied Arms and Mercenaries to both belligerents!! South African private quasi-military organisations have at various times raped the Comoros, Madagasca, DRC, Angola, Equatorial Guinea, Cape Verde, Congo Brazzaville,The Sudan in several states, Ethiopia, Djibouti, Somalia, Liberia/Sierra Leone / Senegal. It wouldn't surprise if Boko Haram and the Malian Insurgency are fueled by South African-supplied Weapons and Weapons Training neither!!

Or that the MRC is tapping into the very large South African Floating Armouries in the Indian Ocean International waters!!

Now they have the AU Chair. On a Morality Platform to boot!! Eiishh!!

you got one point right.
we have men in the theater in somalia.
we have the navy off shores of kismayu,
so what are waiting for?take out the armed groups decisively and there will be no one top buy those south African arms you are talking about.
the not so decisiveness of our Kenyan oversight class has already cost us too much.

Batian Thu Jul 19 2012, 12:49

Ole man's triumph will automatically outline further Pretoria's ambitious continental policy, across Comoros, Somalia, Mali, DRC, however, Ghana's and Nigeria's absenteeism meant that after few more rounds Ole man was to take the chair. Kenya and Erastus Mwencha are ceremonially to push further for another term under the chair of the deputy chairmanship. Are we going to see at the AU a multi-lateralist approach or principled aspirations taking center stage such as those explored during the Mandela years? SA's security, military oversight still remains compounded with graft and an nonexistence of clear policies that govern the strategic arms agreements; meaning parties within the SA democratic space still differ on such agreements. Its national, political, economic, and regional stability nexus is attributable to the regions relative calm and stability (few head-on-collisions with Zimbabwe administration).

On the international front its stance with IRAN seems to be the greatest "separator" between its co-delibarations with the US on matters military within the continent (vis-a-vis johnny's initial vested interests(-AFRICOM-)(-SOCOM-) and it may mean its outflow of qualified personnel to peace keeping missions is slowed by some if not all of these factors(some might disagree). It is also on record that Jean ping had invoked the participation of South Africa, Angola, Nigeria, Ghana, and Guinea to boost the weak AMISOM by overseeing their active participation in Mogadishu.

It is still a mystery why those self-proclaimed muiltilateralist are yet to find it unpopular sending dozens and dozens of young men risking their lives in mercenary operations. SANDF biggest influence was in Sierra-Leone notwithstanding Burundi though its operations were not as hazardous as Sammy and Johnny. What Mogadishu needs is a strong neighbor, one who has been with them and offered them a sanctuary for their people to hibernate when men who had become nuts were keen on deprecating their country one another into a hell-hole.

Guest Thu Jul 19 2012, 14:45

Well, we want to play in the Big League and this is a part of it. Whoever said to would be smooth sailing?

Guest Thu Jul 19 2012, 17:07

countersniper wrote:
we have the navy off shores of kismayu, so what are waiting for?take out the armed groups decisively and there will be no one top buy those south African arms you are talking about. The not so decisiveness of our Kenyan oversight class has already cost us too much.

Two things.
1. International Waters. But for the European Naval Force in that sector, only KDF-Navy/CDU can mount a covert Strike on these buggers. They get dunked.... . Repercussions legal & diplomatic far outweigh the justifications for a Strike. The last of their three known Air-force landings (Hercules Transporters) was in October last year in Crazy Town!!

2. Zoomaliya ought not to be Kenya's burden. The so-called International Community, an euphemism for Western Nations, has far greater loses accruing from this chaotic situation than all of Kenyana combined - in the short term, that is; the Long-term is one whole different biatch!! Moreover this duplicitous behavior is not altogether unknown to these so-called International Community being facilitated and driven by forces within them.

by Vitruvian on Thu Jul 19, 2012 2:45 pm
Well, we want to play in the Big League and this is a part of it. Whoever said to would be smooth sailing?

You are right, whole new level, Boss. Not sure Kenyana is quite ready for this sort of ''gloves-off'' boxing. Lets put down the flames in the Sudans, DRC, and get the Elections over with peacefully in Kenya. And then....

Nesta Thu Jul 19 2012, 23:33

What was our level of involvement in each one of these nations. And when
you talk about us exterminating Rwandese killing machines, are you
talking about killing them or expelling them Kenya Defence Forces (KDF) - Page 26 Icon_e_confused

?

Ole Nkarei The asumption that Wanjiku has an absolute right to know, is the last word
in the determination of her National Interests, that ALL the forty
Million Wanjiku must absolutely be unanimously convinced of every
governance programme is, sorry, fallacious and mere idealism at best.

Wanjiku never knew of our bloody rampages (in her name) in South Sudan, the Great Lakes, Somalia, South Ethiopia and most certainly would not have approved anyway.

Mbaine Fri Jul 20 2012, 01:06

ole Nkarei wrote:
And while we are here, JWTZ is going shopping too, a whooping jump to Ksh.58 Billion this year 2012 on Defense - of which nearly half on ''Developmental Activities'' which is an euphemism to Hardware procurement. Interesting times in Kenyana, no doubt!!

How does the JWTZ fare with regards to UW and SO units? Regarding the challenges they have had with the Zanzibar ferry disaster [my condolences], do they have any specialised diver units or combat diver/SEAL type units akin to the CDU?

Guest Fri Jul 20 2012, 08:46

AzKahia wrote:
ole Nkarei wrote:
And while we are here, JWTZ is going shopping too, a whooping jump to Ksh.58 Billion this year 2012 on Defense - of which nearly half on ''Developmental Activities'' which is an euphemism to Hardware procurement. Interesting times in Kenyana, no doubt!!

How does the JWTZ fare with regards to UW and SO units? Regarding the challenges they have had with the Zanzibar ferry disaster [my condolences], do they have any specialised diver units or combat diver/SEAL type units akin to the CDU?

Nothing remotely similar with special warfare capabilities. But even in Kenya the Mtongwe Ferry was not mitigated by the CDU and KDF-Navy - this is a civilian systemic shortcoming that draws attention too late into the Search and Rescue/ bodies Recovery stage.

JWTZ is still a Proletariat Army in the manner that the Chinese Army was tailored before the Modernization from the Eighties - National Political Indoctrination & Mobilization, National Cohesion in a very ethnically diverse Nation, Youth Employment and a Social Safety Net, that kind of thing.

Private Diving Outfits from TZ and Kenya were engaged last Ferry Disaster.

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