Kenya Defence Force

cylon wrote:
There was also a website talking about Tz Airforce getting Mig-29 but i couldnt confirm the story. does anybody know about this?

Vedomosti reports that the MiG aircraft corporation will sell six MiG-29 fighters to Tanzania for around $50 million.

By early 2000 it was negotiating the sale of MiG-29 to Chad (four units), Uganda (six) and Tanzania (six fighters). And it signed a formal contract with the Democratic Republic of Congo for the delivery of four MiG-29. However, for a number of mainly financial reasons, not one of these projects was implemented, and the market has gradually come to be dominated by Chinese production.

tempest wrote:

cylon wrote:
There was also a website talking about Tz Airforce getting Mig-29 but i couldnt confirm the story. does anybody know about this?

The "Fulcrums for Tanzania" rumour has been around for a while. I gave it a lot of time and came out with nothing.

http://dlib.eastview.com/browse/doc/5166112

Vedomosti reports that the MiG aircraft corporation will sell six MiG-29 fighters to Tanzania for around $50 million.

kms1.isn.ethz.ch/serviceengine/Files/ISN/.../mdb_2_2008.pdf

By early 2000 it was negotiating the sale of MiG-29 to Chad (four units), Uganda (six) and Tanzania (six fighters). And it signed a formal contract with the Democratic Republic of Congo for the delivery of four MiG-29. However, for a number of mainly financial reasons, not one of these projects was implemented, and the market has gradually come to be dominated by Chinese production.

mJESHI mMOJA wrote:@cyclon those are just pictures of Russian boat post a link. As far as I know te Tz doenst have the required dockyard to facilite and service ships of similar dimentions. The Tz Marine patrolling unit that owns several small boat get over haul service in Msa Afrcian Marine Co. our navy is also limited by the Dockyard facilities at motongwe otherwise there several large boat easy to grab. KDF –N has 4 large boats the Nyayo class and several small boat operated by the SBS (small boat squadron). Manda has no way other then to go up to in order to fit in a puzzle.
@Mig-Tz finance doom the deal and opt for a new Mig-21 …may risasi can dwell on it.
@tempest Bravo avatar ……..Zimbabwe AF.
@Vitruvian take it easy

mJESHI mMOJA wrote: @tempest Bravo avatar ……..Zimbabwe AF.

MOOZALENDO wrote: This is worse than the siNer's blog, bwana cylon. By the way is it Cyclon or Cylon? I do get confused. Seriously, I find mareeg too marginal as a source to link to?



Moozalendo

Spartan wrote:No one wants their country, organisation, blog posts or reputation to be maligned on blogs such as this one. The USAF has an assessment flow chart for such situations. We could all learn from it. Ama!?

cylon wrote:

Looks like the Tanzania navy is willing to purchase these 2 Russian naval frigates to begin offshore patrols to protect the vast offshore gas fields

I request Admin to create a column where offending member can be voted
out and subsequently suspended or deleted. By whatever means
gentlemen,sanity must prevail. In all blogs I patronize like
cnn,Huffington post,Redstate and military alike,ADMIN OR MODERATOR
always fires his GPMG whenever necessary. Guys,do not retreat into your
handaki. Ambia CSM/Adm atengeneze orders na kazi iendelee!!!! Btw,Man To
Man;Am Better.

MWAURA wrote:I said the same after it became clear the offender not only ignored all suggestions and hints but went into full on self aggrandisement. Kib'z,bravotwozero and vitruvian I'm with you on this: I can't bear to see this place turned into one man's forum for disneyland/chest thumping/lecturing. I'm off til things change.

tempest wrote:The MMRCA deal is said to be potentially worth or $20b overtime. If I approximate that the French would have made $5m-$10m per JF-17, then 300 units woul have given the French at most $3b Pakistan money.

I general, India is more powerful economically and a "better" partner.

With the benchmarking the Chinese did with other radars to develop the KLJ-7, I woul be suprised is the RC-400 is that much far advanced. In the KLJ-7, they Chinese are not trying to create their best radar ... ... the RC-400 is not the Franch's best either. I would like to think if they Chinese felt like they were loosing a valuable sale, they could/did allowed more tech into the KLJ-7 to apease the PAF.

Please note that the Chinese are still offering the Grifo S-7 as the Falcon-S7 for the FC-17 here http://www.catic.com.cn/indexPortal/home/index.do?cmd=goToChannel&cid=928&columnid=2123&cpid=1656&columnType=102&likeType=view&ckw=AR&lang=US&dataid=4323#

My classic biased thinking would say the Grifo and the RC-400 are GOOD WESTERN radar and better than the KLJ-7. However, that PAF took the KLJ-7 and left the Grifo S-7 on the table says to me the Chinese radar is a strong competitor. I am not sure how the SD-10/PL-9C/PL-5EII compares to the MICA ... ... that might be the actual sweetner.

I request Admin to create a column where offending member can be voted
out and subsequently suspended or deleted. By whatever means
gentlemen,sanity must prevail.


I said the same after it became clear the offender not only ignored all suggestions and hints but went into full on self aggrandisement. Kib'z,bravotwozero and vitruvian I'm with you on this: I can't bear to see this place turned into one man's forum for disneyland/chest thumping/lecturing. I'm off til things change.

jasiri wrote:a bit off on the Indo-Franco Rafale deal...It seems that the Indians awarding the contract for the mmrca to rafale was not so much about quality as it was for strategic interests. In 2010 when Pakistan was inducting it's first thunder birds, they approeached the french to arm their birds with MICA missiles and r-400 radar. The indians seeking to prevent this, arm twited the french into denying the paks this by threatening to cancel the contracts they already have sealed(multi milion dollar contract with DCNS) to sweeten the deal they also threw in the rafale into the mix. deny the paks a handfulof radars and missiles and we we will order 126 combat jets from u.

@blog(esp risasi) still onto my pet topic of the month, the FC-1. Now that the Kenya Air Force is acquiring the Eagle, a need for a second tier combat warplane will definately arise (You can't just deploy a flight of two long range f-15's to scare away militias). Seeing that the f-5's will now probably be retired, will we see the entry of the thunder into our air force? in short, what bird wil replace the tiger?

Ned Starks Head wrote:However to think of it as having such a huge acquisition ~20billion just so your unfriendly neighbor can't get a hold of some older tech, I don't think would have played such a big part in their calculations.

With regards to the KAF I can see where your getting at with a Hi-Lo mix but can the KAF afford such a setup or would the money better be spent on concentrating on a single type of airframe?

jasiri wrote:
@Mwaura they already had a pending contract for the delivery of six scorpene subs and supply of material for the INS Arihant. so technicaly the French were the ones protecting their market. i have no doubt India would have retaliated by cancelling this and optin for the Rssian lada class subs. More advanced than the scorpene anyway and they already have a working relation with the Russians. The radar wasn;t the problem, the missiles were. Pakistani F-16's whipped Indian MiGs suring the war and if they got MICA's inducted, considering they haven't tested the combat abilities of the Thunder, Patel would be in deep shit.

The air force has no choice. As soon as they opted for the F-15 they had to know that a low entry fighter would be needed for skirmish type confrontations. deploying a twin engined bird of the EAgles size for skirmishes is just way to over the line. It's like deploying a Vickers for Pokot-Karamoja catle rustling excapades.

You were very precise on K60. My doubts were based
on distances v birds endurance esp rotors. I blasted couple of emails
and can't believe the theatre am missing! Hope you guys will develop
real live movies from OLN. In my view,it is most advanced and most
tactical ops of it kind in that continent. And still sammy and cousins
don't believe our region is of age.

The BBC said
that the Kenyan military, which has conducted airstrikes several
hundreds of miles south in the Kismayo region, denied hitting targets in
the K60 area today.

Read more: http://www.longwarjournal.org/archives/2012/02/moroccan_jihadist.php#ixzz1oAuBwkHc

The BBC reported the strike came from five helicopters. Its
correspondents in Mogadishu, about 35 miles north of the attack, said
the blast was bigger than anything likely carried out by African forces
fighting in the region.

Read more: http://www.upi.com/Top_News/Special/2012/02/24/Airstrikes-pound-Somalia-after-summit/UPI-43141330100315/#ixzz1oAw7V05N

jasiri wrote:

Ned Starks Head wrote:However to think of it as having such a huge acquisition ~20billion just so your unfriendly neighbor can't get a hold of some older tech, I don't think would have played such a big part in their calculations.

With regards to the KAF I can see where your getting at with a Hi-Lo mix but can the KAF afford such a setup or would the money better be spent on concentrating on a single type of airframe?

@Mwaura they already had a pending contract for the delivery of six scorpene subs and supply of material for the INS Arihant. so technicaly the French were the ones protecting their market. i have no doubt India would have retaliated by cancelling this and optin for the Rssian lada class subs. More advanced than the scorpene anyway and they already have a working relation with the Russians. The radar wasn;t the problem, the missiles were. Pakistani F-16's whipped Indian MiGs suring the war and if they got MICA's inducted, considering they haven't tested the combat abilities of the Thunder, Patel would be in deep shit.

The air force has no choice. As soon as they opted for the F-15 they had to know that a low entry fighter would be needed for skirmish type confrontations. deploying a twin engined bird of the EAgles size for skirmishes is just way to over the line. It's like deploying a Vickers for Pokot-Karamoja catle rustling excapades.

Risasi wrote:The tigers wouldn’t go out of the window the moment a new air bird comes in. a lot has been done in investment and literature it shouldn,t be dispense like that. 10 -15 yre is the official retirement plan.
Contemplation +40pcs Zw-9/Mi-35 around the corner can fill in the blank. Or 12 pcs L-15 trainer/attacker.

+the eagles in question are very diffrent from what you guys know or think they are

@cylon and many you don’t have to run a sophisticated spy ring to decode the next equipment at neighbors. (an eye open to foreign listening ears)
Observe where his kids are fly to for Further studies and training, thats it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vjq5HzXwCGk what equipments and philosopher are they learning. You shouldn’t get shocked to see such a fellow that can run the entire night alone tracking an enemy.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1QW3AtdyqvY&feature=related

So cyclone at the moment they is no major renovation or upgrade on a TZ-N base. No boat of that capacity is sail in this region.

Yes i agree not at the moment because Tz are slow in some governmental departments(no disrespect)They will be forced to make that leap in the near future lets say one year or more once KDF is done with somalia the pressure would be on them to handle the goods coming thru tanzania to the congo and to protect those rich off shore gas fields they have.
TZ-AF dropped the Mig29 deal.. and opted for Improved Chinese copy of the MiG-21…the F-7 https://eastafrican.forumotion.com/t3p90-jeshi-la-wananchi-wa-tanzania-jwtz
It’s said they are “BVR READY”. . the right missile a software upgrade and its set to fire.

@ Ned ..am always amused by the French mistrust , they don’t want to share air defense Tech with anyone, even to the best of their best friends in Europe. Most of the E.U AF’s settled for European consortium EADS joint fighter programs; Tornado and now Euro2000 while some with the US on the F-35. but French stuck to their Dassault Aviation Mirages ….all thanks to hard lesson learned from WWII.

ole Sidai
Congrats to all participants esp that monster Ngondi.....I kidda see his monster knowledge all over theatre!!!
A proud para..
http://www.flickr.com/photos/usarmyafrica/3723095335/in/set-72157621501311566
he echoed in ECOWAS sectors ..
http://allafrica.com/mobile/stories/201111060066.html

jasiri wrote:

cylon wrote:

Looks like the Tanzania navy is willing to purchase these 2 Russian naval frigates to begin offshore patrols to protect the vast offshore gas fields

A mid 80's neustrashmyy class frigate and a mid 60's nanuchka class corvette? Someone in kaka blaza's military planning dept must be dead asleep! how long do they expect to kep this in service? even with mid-life(late life?) upgrades? the cost of modernising and crewing them only to be retired after a decade makes this a very unwise choice. in my opinion, they are beter off with one new and capable PB, like the Australian Armidale class, and a couple of super-dvora type speedboats for high sped interception. surelly there must be something better than a duo of soviet floating cans.

Ned Starks Head wrote: Speaking of Uncle Foos birds - Tempest would you care to comment on the Uncle Foo's birds especially the F7 while in service with the AFZ. Were they considered good pieces of equipment compared to their russian counterparts. Again please only what you feel comfortable discussing or if its open source.

Ned Starks Head wrote:
In terms of the KAF yes if you suppose that the eeefff-15 has been acquired then definitely a ground-pounder is essential and the choice of Uncle woos noodles makes sense. Yet I would argue that a better choice would be to scour the globe to find low airframe f-5's and there should be quite a few considering all the countries that deployed that type. The low air frame F-5's if put through a Mig-21 Bis type upgrade could yield quite a potent aircraft at the fraction of the cost of acquiring a new type.

On the other hand if the eeeff-15 is not in the bag i.e. official confirmation of some sort - then I would much prefer that all the budget is allocated to a single type - swing/multi role bird. TBH the eefff-16 late block models are a really good candidate or perhaps even the nordic birds. I would really love to hear from someone in the know about Uncle woo's birds to make a fair judgment about them.

Ned Starks Head wrote: In terms of the KAF yes if you suppose that the eeefff-15 has been acquired then definitely a ground-pounder is essential and the choice of Uncle woos noodles makes sense. Yet I would argue that a better choice would be to scour the globe to find low airframe f-5's and there should be quite a few considering all the countries that deployed that type. The low air frame F-5's if put through a Mig-21 Bis type upgrade could yield quite a potent aircraft at the fraction of the cost of acquiring a new type.

jasiri wrote:a bit off on the Indo-Franco Rafale deal...It seems that the Indians awarding the contract for the mmrca to rafale was not so much about quality as it was for strategic interests. In 2010 when Pakistan was inducting it's first thunder birds, they approeached the french to arm their birds with MICA missiles and r-400 radar. The indians seeking to prevent this, arm twited the french into denying the paks this by threatening to cancel the contracts they already have sealed(multi milion dollar contract with DCNS) to sweeten the deal they also threw in the rafale into the mix. deny the paks a handfulof radars and missiles and we we will order 126 combat jets from u.

@blog(esp risasi) still onto my pet topic of the month, the FC-1. Now that the Kenya Air Force is acquiring the Eagle, a need for a second tier combat warplane will definately arise (You can't just deploy a flight of two long range f-15's to scare away militias). Seeing that the f-5's will now probably be retired, will we see the entry of the thunder into our air force? in short, what bird wil replace the tiger?

tempest wrote:

Ned Starks Head wrote: In terms of the KAF yes if you suppose that the eeefff-15 has been acquired then definitely a ground-pounder is essential and the choice of Uncle woos noodles makes sense. Yet I would argue that a better choice would be to scour the globe to find low airframe f-5's and there should be quite a few considering all the countries that deployed that type. The low air frame F-5's if put through a Mig-21 Bis type upgrade could yield quite a potent aircraft at the fraction of the cost of acquiring a new type.

I was going through why KAF would have gone for the F-15s. ... ??? ... The USA is using F-16s to good effects in Iraq and Afganistan. The US also strengthened the Pakistani F-16 so PAF can tackle insurgents. i.e. the F-16 is very cable and will do a great job for the KAF. I have there concluded that by looking at Somalia and AS, I am being blinkered and trying to limit Kenya's plans. I believe the F-15 are meant to address bigger concerns than AS!

Adama wrote:
Iran has a few f-5's but i dont know what type of condition they are in but i would like to think they were also reverse-engineered just like there f-14's with Russian tech with new engines,electronics etc. Wouldnt the f-18 hornet be a better choice its a muilt/role fighter that would attack like a bomber,reconnaissance,dogfights,etc rather than the f-15 with is just a really good dog-fighter with a 100-0 kill ratio.