Re: Kenya Defence Forces (KDF)

mJESHI mMOJA Tue Jan 22 2013, 10:19

It can be done its only the magazine capacity that will get reduced.
[url=http://www.naval-technology.com/projects/fly/fly4.htmlThe]http://www.naval-technology.com/projects/fly/fly4.htmlThe[/url] boat has a dead weight of 680tonnes. Since it’s a green water and not an expedition boat then its not all that grave.
A good examples are the hydrofoils of the 80ies.
http://www.militaryphotos.net/forums/showthread.php?138101-Military-hydrofoils-Sparviero-and-Pegasus

mJESHI mMOJA Tue Jan 22 2013, 10:50

Balozi wrote:
Aaaaah!!! i am astounded to see senior Military official at TEA scorn US/UK tools, if I am not mistaken. Whats wrong with their equipment’s. I thought they were the best in the biosphere.

for the records...Mimi bwana I am CORD damu.. Very Happy

i believe in having leaders that are not tainted. we as KDF have a constitutional right to elect and an obligation to server the Govt of the day.’tukutane kwenye debe ndugu. Laughing

mwepesi Tue Jan 22 2013, 12:19

mogen wrote:Wazee, am taking cover immediately. I'll be back when the political chat is over. Bulletman takes my barb for this.

Cheerio

I too passionately believe that Raw Politics should be kept out of this forum, @ Mjeshi & et.al big thumps for trying to bring the ojective of the forum into focus. That said I wish for some clarification here, All along the past years, Since the time of Tonje at the helm, KDF has been matching towards a more Professional & Effective fighting force in the region and we were all Thumps up since then,

Kindly enlighten me why would we start playing partisan politics on the future purchases by KDF vis a vis who will be the C.I.C, Personally I feel we are demeaning the structures, Policies, Strategy and the entire chain of command of KDF by entertaining such notions that who ever will be elected in March 4th polls will DICTATE the future purchase sources of KDF.

aren't this (Trumpeting the purchase path KDF will take to be dependant on who is elected on march 4th) the same scenarios that brought about avenues for corruptions and scandles that the new constitution try to plug by having a transparent procurement by the KDF???? We all know from the laws of nature that for every reaction there is an equal and opposite reaction. (Can be applied on any senario not only in physics) So we should temper our reaction to prerequisite tempo and not sound overtly paranoid over small ripples on the surface.

who said that we can only make strategic military purchases from either the Chinese or the West???? why not countries like Israel, Germany, France, Brasil, SA... the list is endless more importantly why not buy licenses and produce them locally so that the word strategic could really have some meat on it..... Please lets take a minute to observe and reflect on our latest posts.

I agree that politics is crucial in societal development etc etc, Yes, the Ke Constitution grants every kenyan the right to participate in the political process, even prisoners, but we should all learn to avoid speculation and concentrate on issues and policies. it's this kind of rumors and speculation that almost run this country to the gutters the last time we were at general elections & you all know what happened afterwords. we should always learn from our mistakes.

My three cents opinion, “All warfare is based on deception.” Sun Tzu,

jasiri Tue Jan 22 2013, 12:50

@Mwaura, that AMOS mortar system has no recoil that can be compared to a super rapid. on top of that, it is the only armament and it is mounted amidships. The Azmat has to contend with a 7.5 tonne Main gun(super rapid), 6 tonnes of missiles (probably add another 700 kg for the launch canisters etc) an AK-630 gatling gun with a combat weight (loaded) of 2 tonnes. weight for the surface search radar and the AK-630 radar. now tell me u don't think this will impede the performance of the ship.
@Mjeshi, Why is the Jasiri still gun less? I also noticed you rate the Otomat as superior to the YJ-82. Bias ama? Apparently the west ranks the Ying ji as an equal to the Harpoon and in some cases..better.

tres impoli Tue Jan 22 2013, 14:33

Sorry been out for a while and is nice to be back after a short hiatus. Folks we are giving undue prominence to politics at the expense of our major and most important institution in our country- The Military. Judging from how dysfunctional our politics is in terms of policy, process and ideology deficient, i feel we are wasting our precious time on political commentary.
Already we have made them deities vomiting over 40+m Kenyans and trying to convince us that it's only raining and we should consider that a blessing! Personally i see no difference in the so called political parties for they are nothing less than vehicles to amassing power. They never paid any taxes anyway and in civilized societies that's considered a crime!
Please wakenya wezangu let us desist from this divisive talk of politics and talk more on professionalisation of our military. What kind of equipment do they need and how do
we go about procurement of those equipments. That's what we need to be discussing. My pesa nane

Olekoima Tue Jan 22 2013, 18:31

mJESHI mMOJA wrote:
Balozi wrote:
Aaaaah!!! i am astounded to see senior Military official at TEA scorn US/UK tools, if I am not mistaken. Whats wrong with their equipment’s. I thought they were the best in the biosphere.

for the records...Mimi bwana I am CORD damu.. i believe in having leaders that are not tainted. we as KDF have a constitutional right to elect and an obligation to server the Govt of the day.’tukutane kwenye debe ndugu.

Let's move on bro. I think we are done with politics. I had to wait for you guys to finish that stuff. Quite boring i must say.

MWAURA Tue Jan 22 2013, 18:40

jasiri wrote:@Mwaura, that AMOS mortar system has no recoil that can be compared to a super rapid. on top of that, it is the only armament and it is mounted amidships. The Azmat has to contend with a 7.5 tonne Main gun(super rapid), 6 tonnes of missiles (probably add another 700 kg for the launch canisters etc) an AK-630 gatling gun with a combat weight (loaded) of 2 tonnes. weight for the surface search radar and the AK-630 radar. now tell me u don't think this will impede the performance of the ship.
@Mjeshi, Why is the Jasiri still gun less? I also noticed you rate the Otomat as superior to the YJ-82. Bias ama? Apparently the west ranks the Ying ji as an equal to the Harpoon and in some cases..better.

Very likely it will reduce ship's overall efficiency & performance. But,if there is a way to find the deckspace and room for the ammo,I'd be its number one supporter.

Go to 2.40 and see it firing with more firepower than a frigate!

We really can't avoid politics but if we must do politics lets put a special Kenya Elections 2013 page-that's all I ask.

Risasi Tue Jan 22 2013, 19:05

mwepesi wrote:
mogen wrote:Wazee, am taking cover immediately. I'll be back when the political chat is over. Bulletman takes my barb for this.

Cheerio

I too passionately believe that Raw Politics should be kept out of this forum, @ Mjeshi & et.al big thumps for trying to bring the ojective of the forum into focus. That said I wish for some clarification here, All along the past years, Since the time of Tonje at the helm, KDF has been matching towards a more Professional & Effective fighting force in the region and we were all Thumps up since then,

Kindly enlighten me why would we start playing partisan politics on the future purchases by KDF vis a vis who will be the C.I.C, Personally I feel we are demeaning the structures, Policies, Strategy and the entire chain of command of KDF by entertaining such notions that who ever will be elected in March 4th polls will DICTATE the future purchase sources of KDF.

aren't this (Trumpeting the purchase path KDF will take to be dependant on who is elected on march 4th) the same scenarios that brought about avenues for corruptions and scandles that the new constitution try to plug by having a transparent procurement by the KDF???? We all know from the laws of nature that for every reaction there is an equal and opposite reaction. (Can be applied on any senario not only in physics) So we should temper our reaction to prerequisite tempo and not sound overtly paranoid over small ripples on the surface.

who said that we can only make strategic military purchases from either the Chinese or the West???? why not countries like Israel, Germany, France, Brasil, SA... the list is endless more importantly why not buy licenses and produce them locally so that the word strategic could really have some meat on it..... Please lets take a minute to observe and reflect on our latest posts.

I agree that politics is crucial in societal development etc etc, Yes, the Ke Constitution grants every kenyan the right to participate in the political process, even prisoners, but we should all learn to avoid speculation and concentrate on issues and policies. it's this kind of rumors and speculation that almost run this country to the gutters the last time we were at general elections & you all know what happened afterwords. we should always learn from our mistakes.

My three cents opinion, “All warfare is based on deception.” Sun Tzu,

I do apologies for discussing politics and expressing my political view to fellow bloggers. We all know bwana; too much work and no play made jack a dumb boy. Laughing

There is no doubt that will share a little bit of bitterness when we it comes to politics, 4march will affect military strides for tomorrow that’s what I was saying. I have learned out there in my career that there three types of people.

• people that make things happen

• People that watch things happening

• People that wonder, what the hell just happened

we are all free to decide but Just because I am uniformed should I only watch the news of the day or can I also be part of the group that makes the news of day. Laughing

There certain expectation from the WEST that I wouldn’t personally like the next Generation of careers soldiers to inherit esp. with hydrocarbons bubbling out .

Risasi Tue Jan 22 2013, 20:35

proud kenyan wrote:
jasiri wrote:@ Mjeshi, Mwaura, Cycoh (n other 'seamen')
I think those dismissing the Azmat class do not realise how powerful this little boat is. Look at it's armament

1x What looks like a 25mm twin barell auto cannon as the main gun.
*2x quadruple launchers of (i assume) all aspect TY-90 SAM's
2x manual 12.7mm machine guns in the port and starboard.
2x quadruple launchers for the C-802 (Ying Ji 82) anti-ship missile.
air/surface Search radar
another version has

25mm twin barell main gun
1x rear facing AK 630 CIWS
2x quadruple C-802 missile launchers
Air/surface search radar
This is the perfect ship for Kenya, displacement bias aside. It will literary follow you up to your mangrove covered bay, unleash hell with its 25 mike mikes, then turn and power up to 30 knots before you can say 'gunboat'. If faced with a bigger enemy this boat will bloody you. It will fire its 120 km anti-ship missile and turn for home. When you fire your retaliatory salvo, the get plucked out the sky by it rear facing CIWS. It is your evvery day coast guard boat and yet it is a deterrent against EEZ violations too. What more could you ask of a boat? This little beauty packs more punch than allot of the corvettes out there! I'm gunning for this one.
@ Risasi, The Woo family is testing their Globemaster class aircraft naskia inaitwa Y-20. Good stuff Uncle Woo.

problem with the Y20 is the engines..apart from the few constructed runways this bird would have problems landing on the airstrips Risasi and co. use in the region..this would be best suited for missions africa-wide
which also brings up a question: the expeditionary force..what would be needed for it to be fully functional in the long run,assuming what it needs to be up and running and its area of influence in africa as a whole,making the above mentioned bird among others mentioned before (the embraer etc) a neccesary part of stores

Ok back to our norms of business..lakini nyinyi pia mchangiye kwa mjadala to keep the blog boiling.it shouldn,t be a one way traffic.

I agree with Proud citizen on the Xian Y-20. It’s fit for hub to hub transportation. I am not comfortable when it comes to jet engines. They have a “weak stomach for uncooked food” esp. with our environment .but all in all its good for intercontinental hauling.

@jas. I see Mjeshi has turned you into a Buddhist convert ahhh? A Fully fledge Woo

Batian Wed Jan 23 2013, 13:01

@TEA pardon for my late rejoinder but it is really interesting that @risasi is the only one that can comfortably explain that there can be life after sanctions.

wrote:
We are very much on own, our brother's keeper. Regardless of our sometimes violent political divergence, these misplaced notions that somehow Sammy and Johnny will have an Epiphany moment and swoop down to install a preferred regime even when it is evident their Interest will be served by any other regime, is patent ignorant nonsense. Such altruistic idealism has not even once manifested in a millennium of Africa's engagement with the Arabs and the West.

@ON,
it is never misplaced that western regimes will prefer a particular candidate for obvious reasons that can be dictated and summoned whenever to serve their interests. Before Ole man, Johnny was very supportive to the then regime because of the benevolence the government had extended to them in terms of lucrative deals as @risasi pointed out somewhere, in fact, commending the then regime despite it being tainted as corrupt and oppressive.

At some point the then president was summoned abroad by Sammy especially to lectured on how to govern and on a few issues of governance. The only bitter pill to swallow is the is risasi's pill, if we are to maximize the kenyas potential without support that has string attached.
This is also an absolutely perfect opportunity and a chance for kenya to put into good use its new found resources/hydrocarbons that can be further effective if an oil sector ministry can liberalize the sector to avoid collative cartels driven by greed pillaging the sector

Flying Crane Wed Jan 23 2013, 14:44

Come on gentlemen, give the uniformers a break. Shocked

These guys have spoon feed you with privilege soldierly info. for the last 3 yres for once allow them to discuss what’s outside the box. Your new constitution and polls is akin to the first birthday of you first son. Shouldn’t you be part of it, talk about it, and share it with friends?

Uniformers here are under no obligation to teach, tell or educate you on what goes on or what they learn behind those fortified walls, that’s why they get secured in the first place, they are doing so out of passion. No TEA adherent paid a subscription fee to get entertained with military events or doctrines and thus the entertainers shouldn’t stop until he is duly gratified, get that right; we are like minds keen to discuss subjects. Yes they might have posted the topic on the wrong side of the forum, a mistake but ordering them around wouldn’t get you that favorthat you so seek to know. Surprised

Let’s have mutual respect and understanding among ourselves. Stop being hypocrites guys like mwepesi; 28 posting in a year?? what do you actual discuss, if I my ask? That’s for you too olekioma, I have observed you and for some reason or another you are always against the flow of traffic. As I post, ON is busy discuss political excitements elsewhere cause you are not primed to accommodate his interests. So that’s what? Killing or building the forum. The former is the people and what they mutual discuss.

Anyway it’s a domestic affair, I rest my case. Razz

mchoraji Wed Jan 23 2013, 15:29

Flying Crane wrote: Anyway it’s a domestic affair, I rest my case.[/font][/font]
[/color][/font]

Is it just me or does Flying crane just see the wrong in everyone else? I know from recent events i may be biased in my perception of him but still.....there is nothing wrong in mwepesi posting less than 30 posts in an year. he could even join & never post & still be welcome.
too much politics may not be ok here or at least let it be in it's own page as mwaura suggested. we are being bombarded by siasa left right & center let's at least have one place that we can engage politics free. I also can almost bet that there wasn't much in depth analysis from FC when UG was voting in 2011.I had not joined then so I have no idea how forumers handled that important event.it hasn't been that nice reading how & who we shall vote for.lets just wait for the debe, cast our votes then get on with our lives on 5th march.

Olekoima Wed Jan 23 2013, 15:45

Flying Crane wrote:
Come on gentlemen, give the uniformers a break. These guys have spoon feed you with privilege soldierly info. for the last 3 yres for once allow them to discuss what’s outside the box. Your new constitution and polls is akin to the first birthday of you first son. Shouldn’t you be part of it, talk about it, and share it with friends?

Uniformers here are under no obligation to teach, tell or educate you on what goes on or what they learn behind those fortified walls, that’s why they get secured in the first place, they are doing so out of passion. No TEA adherent paid a subscription fee to get entertained with military events or doctrines and thus the entertainers shouldn’t stop until he is duly gratified, get that right; we are like minds keen to discuss subjects. Yes they might have posted the topic on the wrong side of the forum, a mistake but ordering them around wouldn’t get you that favorthat you so seek to know.

Let’s have mutual respect and understanding among ourselves. Stop being hypocrites guys like mwepesi; 28 posting in a year?? what do you actual discuss, if I my ask? That’s for you too olekioma, I have observed you and for some reason or another you are always against the flow of traffic. As I post, ON is busy discuss political excitements elsewhere cause you are not primed to accommodate his interests. So that’s what? Killing or building the forum. The former is the people and what they mutual discuss.

Anyway it’s a domestic affair, I rest my case.

No, you are dead wrong Mr Flying Crane. I' am neither against the flow of traffic nor did i refuse to accommodate other people's interests. What i did was to sit out and let people exhaust whatever they had to say upon which i said we move on from there. If there are still pending matters, people are free to air them. Who am i to gag others? I have been together with the same people since the time of the Chronicles and i have much respect for them and indeed everybody else. I believe i' am mature enough not to bulldoze and hurt others. Frankly speaking, ON and i are actively posting elsewhere and i have no cause to believe i have offended him by my post above. If i did then i' am sorry no offense intended.

Risasi Wed Jan 23 2013, 16:20

My bad I shouldn’t have brought it forward. Let move on……
@batian couldn’t have said it better in those few words..thats what I meant; its not about their persona.. Thanks for the Close air support. I was a staunch CORDee but a rookie convinced me other wish.
@F.crane thanks for the support. Let’s change the frequency back to home base. Very Happy

@mchoraji being a newbie don’t try to cross that mine field man unless you have; a God given thick skin, a helmet ,a bullet proof vest, anti-mine protection vehicle and enough medics just in case, cause it gonna be a bloody old battle just stay off Cranes 12 o’clock at least not now that I am the cause of the subjects.

mchoraji Wed Jan 23 2013, 16:29

Risasi wrote: @mchoraji being a newbie don’t try to cross that mine field man unless you have; a God given thick skin, a helmet ,a bullet proof vest, anti-mine protection vehicle and enough medics just in case, cause it gonna be a bloody old battle just stay off Cranes 12 o’clock at least not now that I am the cause of the subjects.

Sawa boss heard you loud & clear.by the way @ Risasi FC's gun was trained on me recent enough & i know how fast i dived into the nearest handaki loosing my former identity in the process anyway lots to discuss going forward.

mchoraji Wed Jan 23 2013, 17:03

Kenya urged the United Nations Security Council on Monday to make "timely and total reimbursement" of what the country is owed for its military contributions to the African Union Mission in Somalia (Amisom).

Kenya's UN ambassador Macharia Kamau warned that failure to provide Kenya with the full amount pledged by the Security Council is "unacceptable and unsustainable."

In his speech during a Council debate on UN peacekeeping activities, Mr Kamau did not specify how much Kenya is owed. He said only that the country has received "a fraction of the millions of dollars committed by this Council."

According to Kenya's Daily Nation newspaper, the UN agreed to pay Kenya $132 million by July of this year but has so far provided only $947,000.

"Troop-contributing countries spend significant amounts of money preparing troops, maintaining readiness and deploying expensive equipment to support given mandates," Ambassador Kamau noted in his address. That burden weighs particularly heavily on developing countries, he added.

Kenya sent troops into Somalia in October 2010 following a series of terror attacks on Kenyan territory said to have been carried out by forces operating out of Somalia.

The UN Security Council, which partly finances the six-year-old Amisom operation, approved Kenya's participation in the 17,000-member force in a resolution adopted in February 2011.

A total of 4,664 Kenyan personnel deployed in Somalia were formally integrated into Amisom's ranks in June of last year. Kenya had sent troops into the country in October 2011.

In September, the Kenyan forces captured the strategic port city of Kismayu, which was their strategic target and the key source of funding for the Al-Shabaab militia.

Kenya has separately asked the UN to designate the country's maritime forces operating in Somali waters as an official component of Amisom. Such recognition would enable Kenya to receive additional reimbursements from the UN.

The Security Council has so far declined to extend Amisom's mandate to include maritime forces. Mr Kamau says Kenya will raise the issue again in March when the council conducts a scheduled review of Amisom.

When does the UNSC plan to re-imburse kenya for it's trouble ama our officials have to beg after all the sacrifice?

Flying Crane Wed Jan 23 2013, 17:17

Come on mchoraji I never mention you in this, you have no part in this, I don’t want to be part of this. google IDIOT my boy and you find that they replace it with your I.D. So do me a favor and sit down that 5 shilling butt of yours before I turn it into some change.

As for you olekoima honestly I always wondered why you hated manly discussion thats all. Nothing more and it’s no jokes. If I wanted a joke, I'd follow you into the toilet and watch you urinate. I believe you have long hands so do me a favor, give yourself a pat on the back.

mchoraji Wed Jan 23 2013, 17:31

Flying crane you didn't mention me but neither did you mention Risasi & i don't insult....i don't stoop so low i believe in mature structured engagement.you can insult all you want i'l never respond in same way for i know better....& mark you an insult doesn't stick on the skin so i move on with my life not giving a hoot. if people only responded where they are mentioned who would ever respond to anything.
This forum is ours all & none has views which are so important rendering all others useless.so i have a right to air my point & i did it. i still will..... many other times

mwepesi Wed Jan 23 2013, 18:02

Flying Crane wrote:
Let’s have mutual respect and understanding among ourselves. Stop being hypocrites guys like mwepesi; 28 posting in a year?? what do you actual discuss, if I my ask? That’s for you too olekioma, I have observed you and for some reason or another you are always against the flow of traffic. As I post, ON is busy discuss political excitements elsewhere cause you are not primed to accommodate his interests. So that’s what? Killing or building the forum. The former is the people and what they mutual discuss.

Anyway it’s a domestic affair, I rest my case.

@ FC I didn't know we were doing taking polls Basketball

, N'way I am mostly not in a seating environment when working, and in the evening when I have time and i forgo my Tusker i pop in the blog but what i would have wished to respond to would have already been posted.

@ Crane I heard that you guys are closing in on Kony, & retired his messager aka bodygaurd

http://allafrica.com/stories/201301211696.html

And how will UPDF engage with the US considering statements attributed to M7 that UPDF will take over if you MPs continue to misbehave? will your romance dance with the US special forces end????? will this impact on finding kony??? considering the fact that US constitution prohibits military support for coup. will update later.....

Flying Crane Wed Jan 23 2013, 19:23

@mchoraji.. I will agree with you on this one Kid .they is no point for us arguing. The best part of you ended up as an ugly bed sheet stain on that day. It’s not your fault.

@mwepesi

@ FC I didn't know we were doing taking polls , N'way I am mostly not in a seating environment when working, and in the evening when I have time and i forgo my Tusker i pop in the blog but what i would have wished to respond to would have already been posted

Funny you talked about what you do daily and how you spend your day. they is an old saying that goes Brains aren’t everything in life. we both agree with that, becoz In fact in your case they’re nothing. Insanity my friend is doing the same thing, over and over again, and expect different results.

some people think work is a four-letter word. i say What a Face

Fabrizio Wed Jan 23 2013, 20:51

Politics, maybe not in Ug, but at least in Kenya, is a civilian issue. I prefer it be left to the civilians. The military guarantees the security of the nation from external aggression taking direction from civilian authorities. Whichever way you slice it, you have to work with the next duly elected President, personal biases notwithstanding.

There are numerous forums where we can express our political biases with abandon. On this forum, they only bring forth divisions, unfortunately for Kenya, along ethnic fault-lines. No matter how well presented. A problem our military has so far been spared.

I prefer to keep the forum strictly focused on non-local politics.

Batian Wed Jan 23 2013, 21:33

Risasi wrote:
@batian couldn’t have said it better in those few words..thats what I meant; its not about their persona.. Thanks for the Close air support. I was a staunch CORDee but a rookie convinced me other wish.

@Risasi

thanks my pleasure always Very Happy

, tell @ flying crane to learn some swahili lol that palipo na wazee hapaharibiki jambo, once in a while uniforms can engage anything outside communiques', The OLN seems almost ending so tit-bits to engage upon are becoming scarce though effort well spent Cool

proud kenyan Thu Jan 24 2013, 05:31

authenticity not known,hope the hunters and gatherers from 30th and 40th are now in overdrive

http://www.nation.co.ke/News/africa/Somali-Islamists-threaten-to-execute-Kenyan-hostages-/-/1066/1673826/-/vlkun1z/-/index.html

Uzi Thu Jan 24 2013, 05:57

Risasi wrote:

If we go the CORD way Woo/Ivan get pushed off without a blink and we have to bow to that single idol once again. We are good boys now and several Ex-US Force equipment’s start flocking in and we (military) go back to the 80 and 70. Johhny/Sammy stuff from the belt to the button. And Johnny/Sammy stuff definitely comes with clauses. fail them and we are grounded bro. According to him the Ole Man gamble and experimented with Woo and the results were witness and impressive in OLN. Don,t let that go out the window by “Electing Moral up right men”. In OLN the Puma was rivaled with theMi-171,Buff with the Y-12 and MD500 with Z-9. And they wasn,t a time in the Ops that we felt Ivan/Woos stuff was strangling to keep up with johnnies.lets continue with them with free hands.

CORD will bring the west back to the defense budgets again; expensive equipment’s, sound names (good for the wanainchi) but with compiling clauses.

Lets keep it jubilee a bitter pill with a brighter future. in fact UHURUTO will strive to meet the citizens demand in order to create a good name because they are international reject s even if they want to get financial mischievous they don,t have the dens to hide the cash.

Nikona shida?

Does it make sense?

How much is fact and fiction?

i rest my case

@Risasi u have always fed us well b4 but this time sorry umechemsha! To paraphrase u "If we go the CORD way
Woo/Ivan get pushed off without a blink and we have to bow to that
single idol once again. We are good boys now and several Ex-US Force
equipment’s start flocking in and we (military) go back to the 80 and
70. Johhny/Sammy stuff from the belt to the button."
Last time i checked Egypt with the fourth largest F16 inventory was set to receive over 40 Mig29's from Ivan. Are u suggesting that the much talked about eagles are actually not here and this is because of uncle Woo's and Ivan's Kenyan presence? How were we able to purchase the Mi6's and AR15's from Sam?
I suspect you and ON are telling us ur personal bias and re-packaging it philosophically. How much is fact and fiction? U tell us.

Guest Thu Jan 24 2013, 08:27

Oh great, Fabrizio! These seems to be a synchronicity (read: a simultaneous occurrence of events which appear significantly related but have no discernible causal connection) in our posting. Now Ole Nkarei will never believe that we are in fact distinct entities.

Fabrizio wrote:Politics, maybe not in Ug, but at least in Kenya, is a civilian issue. I prefer it be left to the civilians. The military guarantees the security of the nation from external aggression taking direction from civilian authorities. Whichever way you slice it, you have to work with the next duly elected President, personal biases notwithstanding.

There are numerous forums where we can express our political biases with abandon. On this forum, they only bring forth divisions, unfortunately for Kenya, along ethnic fault-lines. No matter how well presented. A problem our military has so far been spared.

I prefer to keep the forum strictly focused on non-local politics.

timoh Thu Jan 24 2013, 08:36

@uzi...go easy man.
about the shebaabs threat to execute our pple by feb14....hope we will do something about if indeed we dnt negotiate with terrorist

mchoraji Thu Jan 24 2013, 08:48

timoh wrote:@uzi...go easy man.
about the shebaabs threat to execute our pple by feb14....hope we will do something about if indeed we dnt negotiate with terrorist

The only problem Timoh is that the brigands having issued the ultimatum are going to be really expecting a reaction by the KDF. if that were to happen, the hostages would be the ones to suffer. i believe the KDF would not pull the kind of stunt Algeria's military did last week. so many innocent people died in the aftermath. any intelligence already gathered on their whereabouts & possible rescue options may not really help in the lead-up to the deadlines set by these terrorists.it may have been best to strike when they were not expecting & the benefit of surprise would really have worked to the rescuers' advantage. Francois also has really muddied the waters with what he did the other day. all the same we hope this ends well

Spartan Thu Jan 24 2013, 09:36

mwepesi wrote:And how will UPDF engage with the US considering statements attributed to M7 that UPDF will take over if you MPs continue to misbehave? will your romance dance with the US special forces end????? will this impact on finding kony??? considering the fact that US constitution prohibits military support for coup. will update later.....

The army is the last resort in Ug, like anywhere else including the US. In a situation where animosity between the executive and the legislature brings the country to its knees, the executive would use its instruments of coercion to prevail until such a time as conditions change. He was just stating the obvious, which has precedents allover the world. But we are miles away from any situation that would warrant that.

Fabrizio wrote: Politics, maybe not in Ug, but at least in Kenya, is a civilian issue. I
prefer it be left to the civilians. The military guarantees the
security of the nation from external aggression taking direction from
civilian authorities.

Oouuch. Bwana, did you have to bring us up to make your point? In Uganda, the army considers itself a 'revolutionary' army first and foremost, with 'professionalism' comes a good second. The world is rife with examples of countries with such armies, especially countries with a socialist and troubled past. Look, we can't all move at the same pace, and there are advantages and disadvantages to each style. We tackled these with all manner of emotions in The Nairobi Chronicles, and we have since moved over. I add my voice to those who say we expunge politics from these pages.

mogen Thu Jan 24 2013, 10:52

Risasi and others, please, please. Keep our highly divisive partisan local politics out of this forum. You have no convincing excuse to discuss partisan politics here.

In our country 3 institutions (plus their leaders) must remain neutral and be seen to be neutral. Yes, even if that means the leaders keeping their political preferences private and it doesn't matter whether they are voters or not. [in fact, you should ask yourself why the IEBC Chairman, like many others elsewhere, chose not to vote].

The Judiciary, Electoral Commission and the Military are the last custodians of the peace in the unlikely event of the political players disagreeing during or after the elections and causing trouble. In fact, recently the CDF (thro' his Deputy) talked of KDF's political neutrality at a major function in Mombasa. Of course, it is ok to vote and have political opinions but they should never be expressed in a manner likely to be confused for an official position because doing so could bring disrepute to the KDF. Yes, Risasi ukivaa kirauni na kupaa angani 'you are colourless' in matters of partisan politics. Any expression of political opinion by uniforms, more so ranking ones, can be (mis)construed to mean campaigning. Please don't go there.

With regard to procurement of inventory, you guys have previously told us here that the KDF has well-established systems with checks and balances in place to stop the anglo-fleecing type scandals. Moreover, the Defence Council's role isn't diminishing and the C-in-C, whoever it is, cannot just ignore advise from his Generals. You also told here (previously) that once the Defence Council has decided on an Officer's promotion no one can change that. That should also apply to inventory procurement.

in short, stop campaigning for your candidates here and if you do elsewhere be sure to remove your kirauni while politiking. I cannot countenance seeing the CDF in uniform attending a charged and highly partisan political rally. Neither should i spot you there in your uniform. Whenever and wherever you are in uniform you are representing the KDF and you should never bring that highly esteemed institution into disrepute. This admonition definitely applies to the KDF but does not apply to revolutionary armies (I have lived under the the world's largest Revolutionary Army for years and know that they breath, eat and sleep tinkering in politics).

Risasi na wengine, nawaheshimu sana. Please do not do that again.Over and out now!

Risasi Thu Jan 24 2013, 10:59

Vitruvian wrote:Oh great, Fabrizio! These seems to be a synchronicity (read: a simultaneous occurrence of events which appear significantly related but have no discernible causal connection) in our posting. Now Ole Nkarei will never believe that we are in fact distinct entities.

Fabrizio wrote:Politics, maybe not in Ug, but at least in Kenya, is a civilian issue. I prefer it be left to the civilians. The military guarantees the security of the nation from external aggression taking direction from civilian authorities. Whichever way you slice it, you have to work with the next duly elected President, personal biases notwithstanding.

There are numerous forums where we can express our political biases with abandon. On this forum, they only bring forth divisions, unfortunately for Kenya, along ethnic fault-lines. No matter how well presented. A problem our military has so far been spared.

I prefer to keep the forum strictly focused on non-local politics.

lol

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